Is the 'Cloud' just a marketing buzzword?

And BTW, OpenStack is the first OSS that let’s you (and other big names) build a powerful cloud infrastructure platform (including the APIs I spoke about). It is the core to, for instance, Rackspace’s “cloud computing” infrastructure and they are heavy contributors to the project (they were basically co-founders of it).

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To me, ‘cloud’ is a buzzword. All the things of BlahBlahService has been done before ‘cloud’ became a buzz word. Just because it can scale down/up doesn’t mean it’s a cloud. Heck, I can turn off/on the server clustering to save electricity. That’s just a concept of ‘hosting’ which has been done since the beginning of the internet. Now they have a new model which is like a taxi fare ‘pay what you use’ which is again… hosting strategy and nothing to do w/ cloud computing. Some define ‘cloud’ as something they can’t touch in their arms reach. To me, ‘cloud computing’ != ‘cloud resourcing’ For example, you can’t make a baby to born faster by hiring 8 more pregnant ladies. True cloud computing is something that it would normally take 10 hours down to 1 hour by using multiple ‘cloud’ resources on a ‘single’ task. Otherwise, that’s just load balancing to make the service more available. Again, this is just my ‘cloud computing’ point of view as there are thousands.

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And, hope you can take this critique positively, but you have some learning to do to correct your point of view, because it is most definitely based on incorrect assumptions and conceptual misrepresentations.

Scott

I’m not saying that my opinion is the true answer to the question. Some see this as a cloud

  • Doing development using ‘remote desktop’
  • Uploading files to dropbox
  • Doing scaling/load balancing
  • Doing multi-processing task
    +10000 variants

I guess what could it NOT be ‘cloud’ at this point? All I’m saying is that it has so many definitions to a point of futility

I definitely see “cloud” as a marketing buzzword.

@s_molinari I don’t at all think you’re wrong - I think there are some clear, definitive sets of criteria and definitions out there. I think that ‘cloud computing’ means something, in specific. But. The general public? Marketing departments of companies? No. There’s no specificity there.

When I was doing more freelancing, last summer, I had a small traditional marketing company talking to me that were talking about offering their “cloud” services. They don’t even have a web developer on staff. They just do some contract development. They had no concept of what the word meant, but using it in conversation was generating interest and driving clients to them.
I’ve run into countless advertisements for products in the cloud. People think that their data, when in the cloud, is immune to hardware failure, etc. because it’s not on actual hard drives anymore, but stored in the “cloud” - whatever that means. Now, in some cases they’re partially right - data stored in a “cloud” enviroment, for example, may have multiple redundant systems in place to protect it. But it’s still stored on metal, in the end, isn’t it?

I could go on and on with examples. People, in general, do not have a clear definition for what “cloud” means - and so to the masses, I think “cloud” absolutely is a marketing buzzword - and one that works.
In our industry - not so much.

There are many things that have legitimate definitions, or particular dependencies, that are misused/misrepresented/etc, whether in terminology or in other areas - applications or tools or whatever. That’s the way people operate, especially when selling something :smiley:

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At this point, we can at least agree w/ 1 concept

“Any computer task done on a machine that the user is not ‘currently’ using is called cloud”… I’m just j/k but I feel we can agree to this

It is basically fairly simple.

the Cloud (the word alone) = the Internet. So “Cloud Services” are the same as “Internet services”.

cloud computing = a symbiosis of infrastructure (IaaS) and software, which builds the basis (PaaS) for scalable web based applications (SaaS).

And just because a service is on the Internet DOES NOT make it SaaS. It needs to have the other levels of cloud computing behind it to be true SaaS and this is where a lot of marketing use the terms “SaaS” and “Cloud” improperly to embellish their Internet services. When they do it, then they are misusing the words and that is the only reason “Cloud” and “Cloud Computing” have any form of hype.

The two are real for sure.

Scott

he Cloud (the word alone) = the Internet. So “Cloud Services” are the same as “Internet services”.

Can you source that, for the benefit of the discussion? Where do you get your definition? I know there is definitely disagreement on that point (maybe not in this thread, but in general).

Also, I see the word “cloud” used regularly in marketing hype without mentioning SaaS. If all Internet Services are Cloud Services, as you suggest, then you’re implying that it’s not hype at all, but 100% accurate?

Interesting reading:

Wikipedia, for one, definitely seems to suggest that “Cloud” does not at all equal “The Internet”. It’s more complicated than that definition.

Nope, because “the Cloud” is something marketing came up with out of cloud computing, which started with Amazon’s web services in 2006.

The Wikipedia article you linked to is about “Cloud Computing” and NOT “the Cloud” and I think I’ve demonstrated in all of my posts and my blog post that the two are not the same.

Cloud Computing will always build up Cloud resources and services, but not all Cloud resources or services are built on Cloud Computing.

If you can access the resource or service on the Internet, then it is in “the Cloud”.

Oh, and the author of the other article you linked also doesn’t understand the difference.

Scott

If you can access the resource or service on the Internet, then it is in “the Cloud”.

Still can’t back up that statement, and at least in my experience, that is not a universally agreed upon definition; so until you can show me, I’ll assume it’s your opinion :wink:

The Wikipedia article, for whatever wikipedia is worth, equates the term “the cloud” with “cloud computing” - that’s why I have it linked there. I assume you’ll disagree with the article’s loose definition; but if you read before responding you could have disagreed with the correct part :smiley:

Oh, and the author of the other article you linked also doesn’t understand the difference.

Either source, or properly explain, your definition or your position, or stop saying stuff like that. It’s annoying when people just say “I’m right, because I said so before”. Isn’t it? We’re here to teach and to learn - that doesn’t facilitate learning.

I’m not even saying I disagree with you - I just think it’s not that clear-cut, and you haven’t showed why you’re right. Not here, nor in your blog post.

From
Host Your Web Site in the Cloud: Amazon Web Services Made Easy
by Jeff Barr
Copyright © 2010
Published bu SitePoint Pty Ltd

from page 5

The cloud was used to indicate the Internet. Over time the meaning of “the Internet” has shifted, where it now includes the resources usually perceived as being on the Internet as well as the means to access them.

The term cloud computing came into popular use just a few years before this book was written. Some were quick to claim that, rather than a new concept, the term was siimply another name for an existing practice. On the other hand, the term has become sufficiently powerful for some existing web applications have to magically turned into examples of cloud computing in action! Such is the power of marketing.

While the specifics may vary from vendor to vendor, you can think of the cloud as a coherent, large-scale, publicly accessible collection of compute, storage, and networking resources. These are allocated via web service calls (a programmble interface accessed via HTTP requests), and are available for short- or long-term use in exchange for payment based on actual resources consumed.

My take is that term “cloud” is used both to hype and to indicate something a “bit different”, in particular the adaptability to scale both up and down quickly as use changes

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Where is that equation made? I don’t see it.

These are some resources “in the Cloud” that agree with me.

The cloud is the Internet - in other words a network of servers.

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The cloud, simply, refers to software and services that run on the Internet instead of your computer.

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Strictly speaking – everything you do online, you are doing “in the cloud.”

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The cloud is a metaphor referring to networks, specifically the Internet, that have been represented in engineering and network drawings for some time.

And a lot of people go into what “the Cloud” is and then start explaining cloud computing and that is a mistake.

Scott

In that Wikipedia article, there is this definition of what cloud computing must be to be considered cloud computing.

On-demand self-service. A consumer can unilaterally provision computing capabilities, such as server time and network storage, as needed automatically without requiring human interaction with each service provider.

Broad network access. Capabilities are available over the network and accessed through standard mechanisms that promote use by heterogeneous thin or thick client platforms (e.g., mobile phones, tablets, laptops, and workstations).

Resource pooling. The provider’s computing resources are pooled to serve multiple consumers using a multi-tenant model, with different physical and virtual resources dynamically assigned and reassigned according to consumer demand.

Rapid elasticity. Capabilities can be elastically provisioned and released, in some cases automatically, to scale rapidly outward and inward commensurate with demand. To the consumer, the capabilities available for provisioning often appear unlimited and can be appropriated in any quantity at any time.

Measured service. Cloud systems automatically control and optimize resource use by leveraging a metering capability at some level of abstraction appropriate to the type of service (e.g., storage, processing, bandwidth, and active user accounts). Resource usage can be monitored, controlled, and reported, providing transparency for both the provider and consumer of the utilized service.
—National Institute of Standards and Technology[3]

These points, except for broad network access, are enabled through software like OpenStack, which was mentioned earlier.

So to reiterate, you can have a cloud computing service (SaaS) and it is in the Cloud. You can also have a website like Sitepoint, which also is only available on the Internet and thus also “in the Cloud”, but (I am almost certain) it is not a true SaaS application, so it has nothing to do with cloud computing.

Scott

Thanks for the contribution! That’s helpful.

So, some of these seem to agree with you; The CNN Money one doesn’t, not really, as it explicitly refers to software and services run on the Internet, and you’re saying “The Internet” which are different things. It more is in line with @Mittineague and @oddz above. However, I’d also rate CNN Money fairly low on my “authorities in all things tech” list :wink:

What’s your take on @Mittineague’s quote above, though? And @oddz opinion here?

Breaking down what “the cloud” represents from a technical perspective requires understanding these things: SaaS (software as a service), PaaS (patform as a service), IaaS (Infrastructure as a service), and DaaS (desktop as a service). “The cloud” is a term used to describe those things.

The Wikipedia article seems to not differentiate:

Cloud computing, or in simpler shorthand just “the cloud”, also focuses on maximizing the effectiveness of the shared resources. Cloud resources are usually not only shared by multiple users but are also dynamically reallocated per demand.

So that’s not super useful to anyone.

What is it everyone uses on the Internet? Software and Services? Is there any other reason why someone would use the Internet?

It is then clear, when I say "the Cloud* is the same as “the Internet”, it includes what you can access on or through the Internet. If it is in the Cloud, then it is on the Internet, because the Internet (the services and software on it) is the Cloud.

Let’s just say, if my prediction is correct, that some time in the future, all computing on the Internet will be done through cloud computing, then it really doesn’t matter what the Cloud is. It will all be the same at that time anyway.

Scott

“The Internet” has a clear definition, which isn’t what you just said, that’s all I’m saying - the Internet and the Cloud are not exactly congruous. My own opinion (and it is an opinion, as is yours, since it’s a term that’s not well defined in any cohesive way) is that the other posts are pretty accurate. The cloud is a collection of Internet services/applications/etc/etc.

Let’s just say, if my prediction is correct, that some time in the future, all computing on the Internet will be done through cloud computing, then it really doesn’t matter what the Cloud is. It will all be the same at that time anyway.

Yeah, absolutely. We’re definitely getting to the cloud-computing-only place, aren’t we? Isn’t the cloud services phenomenon (look at Chromebooks as a perfect example?) interesting? We as a technology culture for awhile pushed hard on device specifications for power, and away from server-client models at least a little bit (dumb clients??) - and now we’re relaxing a bit on the power and space and starting to rely on cloud applications, and just focusing on graphics and appearance of devices. Kind of a bit of a curved process, wasn’t it?

We are actually heading back to the old “mainframe - client” paradigm, but at a much larger scale and with different mainframes and clients.

Scott

Yeah… interesting times.I can’t imagine what the technological landscape is going to be like for little kids, now, once they’re entering the workforce. 10-20 years can change a whole lot of stuff.

I thought the cloud was something that allowed you to sync all your devices with the same data and files. So actually, based on this article, it is probably a “service” of some kind, one among many?

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